E&OE TRANSCRIPT
RADIO INTERVIEW
ABC BRISBANE DRIVE
MONDAY, 24 AUGUST 2020
SUBJECTS: Lou Reed; Aged care crisis; Australians returning from overseas; China’s Thousand Talents program.
[Prefaced by talkback discussion about Lou Reed.]
STEVE AUSTIN, HOST: Jim Chalmers is the Labor Member from Rankin here in Queensland. Jim Chalmers, why did you choose to go back and not Zoom in remotely?
JIM CHALMERS, SHADOW TREASURER: First-things-first, Steve, I've got a bit of trivia for you about Lou Reed.
AUSTIN: Okay, hit me with it.
CHALMERS: Albanese, Chalmers, and Reed: all born on 2 March.
AUSTIN: Come on!
CHALMERS: It's true.
AUSTIN: There's a conspiracy theory in the making -
CHALMERS: And Jon Bon Jovi.
AUSTIN: Well there you go. All on the same day; Albanese, Chalmers, Lou Reed and Jon Bon Jovi.
CHALMERS: Yep, 2 March.
AUSTIN: You're all rock stars. Well not quite.
CHALMERS: Three out of four.
AUSTIN: Three out of four. Alright. Why did you go back to Canberra and not Zoom in remotely?
CHALMERS: When it looked like our families would have to quarantine with us when we got back, that was probably going to be a bit hard. But when we got the advice that said we had to quarantine but our kids could still go to school and partners could still go to work, I thought on balance it was probably the right thing for me to be here. A lot of the issues in my portfolio are relatively prominent this week and next. I spoke to the family and decided to come down. Other people have made different decisions. I think that's good too, particularly for our Melbourne colleagues. It's extraordinarily difficult to lockdown with families for that time. They were able to participate via video conference and I thought that was great, and worked out well.
AUSTIN: Did you bump into or sit next to Terri Butler, who's just left the Chamber for a COVID-19 test?
CHALMERS: I saw her earlier in the day, but there's lots of social distancing happening here. I think it was good that Terri went and got the test. She's one or two people from someone who was at one of those contact tracing places. Out of an abundance of caution she did the right thing, went and got a test and is isolating until she gets the result.
AUSTIN: My guest is Jim Chalmers, Labor Member for Rankin, and Shadow Treasury spokesperson. Today two things took place. The Prime Minister said and I quote, "I offer my apologies to the residents and families of those affected in aged care facilities, it was not good enough". And Aged Care Minister Senator Richard Colbeck told the Senate that he should have had the data on aged care deaths on Friday when he appeared before the COVID Committee and he apologised, and took full responsibility for not having that data. Does the Opposition accept those apologies?
CHALMERS: I guess we have to, Steve, but they’re not the only issues in aged care. Some days the Prime Minister seems intent on pointing the finger when it comes to aged care. There's no doubt in our mind that aged care is a Commonwealth responsibility. There's absolutely no doubt that it's become one of the defining debacles of this response to -
AUSTIN: The Prime Minister said today it's not just a Commonwealth responsibility, that there is State responsibility as well?
CHALMERS: It's pretty clear it's a Commonwealth responsibility overwhelmingly. Some days he seems to -
AUSTIN: It is one of those shared jurisdiction areas though isn't it?
CHALMERS: Not really. Not really Steve. It's pretty clear that aged care is Commonwealth. There have been times where he has conceded that, but other days unfortunately he gets into the weasel words that people don't like.
AUSTIN: So what further should happen as far as the Opposition is concerned about aged care in Australia? $300 billion of public money, I think from memory, each year.
CHALMERS: I think the most important number is the 328 older Australians who've died from COVID in these places. That tells us that not having a plan for aged care during this challenging time, not having the workforce issues sorted out, not having the response as good as it could have been, is likely to have cost lives. I think that's the most important thing, but there are other issues as well. The Government's been in office for seven years now and there's been issues around workforce, issues around funding, issues around standards, the use of chemical and physical restraints, the long home care waiting list, all of these issues have been around well before COVID. There's a royal commission which is looking at some of them now which is important. No doubt they'll make some strong recommendations.
AUSTIN: Some of them? Is that enough of them?
CHALMERS: What do you mean, sorry?
AUSTIN: You said the royal commission is looking at some of those issues. Are you suggesting that they should look at more of them?
CHALMERS: No, they're having a broad look at the system.
AUSTIN: Okay.
CHALMERS: They've already made some interim recommendations. They've said that we should get younger people out of homes, we should deal with the home care lists, the system should be less reliant on people using chemical and physical restraints on people. All of these things are really important. But the system itself is not providing the care that older people need and deserve after a lifetime of contributing to this country. We need to fix it. In order to fix it, the Prime Minister needs to properly take responsibility for it.
AUSTIN: When's Labor going to put up an alternative plan or a few ideas of how to fix it?
CHALMERS: We've been making suggestions along the way. Our spokeswoman Julie Collins has been doing that, and Anthony Albanese and others have been doing that. We also want to pay close attention to what the royal commission recommends as well as it finalises it's report.
AUSTIN: Jim Chalmers is my guest, Labor member for Rankin here in Brisbane. I'll speak with the LNP rep around the same time tomorrow. It's 4:42PM. I'll move on. I'll see what happens in Federal Parliament, Jim Chalmers, but let's move onto the issue that's animating many listeners here in Queensland; the Federal Government cap on international passenger arrivals. Should there be a cap on international arrivals, or should we look at changing it, adjusting it, or lifting in some way?
CHALMERS: It should always be under review so that it's responsive to what's actually happening in the community, and what's helping on the health front and the economic front. I think in principle a cap can make sense. It helps us manage the virus. It helps us manage all of the necessary quarantine and all of that. If it's based on good, sound medical advice then that's a good thing. If that medical advice evolves, so should the cap.
AUSTIN: We're hearing many stories. Everyone has a different personal story obviously. But there are Australian citizens who are overseas, stranded often because they can't afford to pay for business class airfares that may or may not be done in an auction process by some very major airlines - not QANTAS I point out, but major overseas airlines - or who have had fights simply cancelled. I'm just wondering what the point of being an Australian citizen is if that citizenship doesn't guarantee you entry into your own country?
CHALMERS: I can certainly understand the anxiety. As local Members we have helped or tried to help a bunch of people get home. We know that it's really difficult. It's really expensive. We've heard of flights costing $15,000 and $20,000 which is bad enough on its own, but imagine if you've got a family that you're trying to return to Australia with. There's a lot of anxiety. We need to make sure that we get those people home, but doing so in a responsible way. For a lot of people that's meant they're stuck overseas for longer than they'd like and we acknowledge that.
AUSTIN: I'd love to talk to you more about this. We're finding problems with this. This is ABC Radio Brisbane. It's 4:49PM. Just a quick one; the front page of today's Australian newspaper about the number of scientists who were using Australia research funding in Australian universities but it turns out their research was being patented perhaps the deceptively or dishonestly in China. It's quite an extraordinary story in terms of detail. The Liberal Andrew Hastie has called for a parliamentary committee inquiry into what's going on with Australian-funded research being patented in China apparently being used for other purposes. Will the Opposition support that?
CHALMERS: We'll have a look at it. They haven't come to us in any formal form yet. What usually happens is that we get it formally, we have a discussion about it, and then we announce our position. But certainly we do recognise that this is an issue. We've said that for some time now. We've got to be really careful about safeguarding the good reputation that our universities have. We need to make sure that we are -
AUSTIN: Some of them weren't even aware apparently that this research had been patented in China and they were funding it.
CHALMERS: It was a very concerning report. The program itself that's referred to there, I think it's called the Thousand Talents program, that's not a new program. There have been concerns raised about protecting the reputation of our universities, but also in turning the ideas that we have here into jobs here. Turning our ideas into jobs is a really crucial part of how we're going to recover from this crisis.
AUSTIN: Absolutely.
CHALMERS: We need to make sure that the Government's providing the best possible advice to universities for how they deal with this. They'll be getting all kinds of advice, the Government that is, behind closed doors, which we're not privy to. Hopefully that information is being turned into good advice for the universities to protect their reputation, and to protect their researchers and their ideas.
AUSTIN: It looks like intellectual property theft by a different means?
CHALMERS: This has been a concern for some time. Take the specifics out of it for a moment. In general, intellectual property is a really big concern, the theft of it is a big concern around the world. We need to make sure that people who have the ideas, have the capacity to commercialise them and turn them into jobs so that more people can prosper from them.
AUSTIN: I'll let you get back to things. Thanks for coming on.
CHALMERS: Thank you, Steve.
ENDS
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