E&OE TRANSCRIPT
TELEVISION INTERVIEW
ABC NEWS BREAKFAST
FRIDAY, 25 SEPTEMBER 2020
 
SUBJECTS: Passing of Dean Jones; Proposed lending changes; Debt and deficit; Energy. 

LISA MILLAR, HOST: Shadow Treasurer, Jim Chalmers, good morning. I actually want to start this chat today with sad news from India overnight. Were you a cricketing kid? Do you have memories of Dean Jones?
 
JIM CHALMERS, SHADOW TREASURER: Good morning, Lisa. Dean Jones was an iconic Australian, full of character and confidence. He was such an important part of those really gutsy Australian teams of the 80s and early 90s. I do well-remember as a kid growing up in Brisbane those summer nights watching Dean Jones. The one day internationals in particular, and when Dean Jones came to the crease at first drop you knew something exciting was about to happen. He scored quickly, he took chances. Right around the world, not just in Australia and not just for cricket fans, I think it's a really sad day for a lot of people and for all of his admirers.
 
MILLAR: Well-said. Let's turn to the issues in your portfolio today. This announcement from Josh Frydenberg about the loosening of bank lending. That's going to be good news for a lot of people, homeowners, businesses people wanting to buy homes. Do you think it'll help kickstart the economy?
 
CHALMERS: Obviously we want people who can afford to repay loans, whether it's ordinary workers or small businesses, we want them to be able to access finance if they've got the capacity to pay it back. We want to make sure that any lending is responsible though. We want to make sure that people don't get in over their head. We want to make sure that people aren't caught in debt traps. So we'll have a look at what the Government's proposing, it wouldn't kick in until March, so we've got some time to consider it and to consult widely on the proposed changes. The Government does have a bit of form, unfortunately, in going easy on the banks and the loan sharks at the expense of ordinary people so we'll have a look at it. If it makes sense, we'll support it. If we think that it tips the balance too far in one direction, then we'll make our views known about that as well.
 
MILLAR: We're getting some really clear directions from the Treasurer about what to expect out of the budget, including this speech that he gave yesterday tying debt and surpluses to the 6 per cent unemployment benchmark, what do you think of that?
 
CHALMERS: Well, it's hard to take him seriously when he's got a new budget strategy in the last couple of days when he got absolutely nowhere near achieving his last budget strategy.
 
MILLAR: That was before the pandemic we can sort of put all of that aside can't we?
 
CHALMERS: Well let's talk about before the pandemic then, Lisa. This is a Government that promised a surplus in its first year and every year but delivered six deficits before the pandemic. Debt was already at record highs before the pandemic. So that's an important piece of history to factor in. We've been consistent all along, we've acknowledged the impact of this virus on the economy and on the budget. We've said that the highest priority has to be supporting people and their jobs. But every dollar here is a borrowed dollar. We need to make sure we get maximum bang for buck out of that and we measure that by what it means for people and for their employment. So the new budget strategy that the Treasurer has just announced, and I think we'll get another record deficit announced later today, needs to be seen in the broader context of a Government that hasn't hit any of its budget targets so far. We're heading towards a trillion dollars in debt and we've still got unemployment which is unacceptably high and will be for unacceptably long. I think people will judge them for that.
 
MILLAR: Isn't the plan of the Government that they're outlining to spend money, and that austerity is not the way to go? Surely Labor would be supporting that?
 
CHALMERS: Two things about that Lisa and we've been consistent in saying when times are tough as they are now, we're in the teeth of the deepest recession we've had here in almost a century, and when times are tough, yes the government should step in and should support jobs and should support people. We've been consistent about that during the Global Financial Crisis, since then, and now. That is an important principle that we've been consistent on, the other side of the Parliament has not been consistent on that. The other point is this, the Government says that they think it's time to support people in the economy at the same time as they're actually withdrawing support from the economy. JobSeeker will be cut today, JobKeeper will be cut on Monday, and that means billions of dollars less circulating in the shops, small businesses and local economies of this country. So they say they want to support people at the same time as they're actually withdrawing support, and I don't think that makes a lot of sense when we've got high unemployment, almost a million people unemployed, and we're in the teeth of this horrible recession.
 
MILLAR: Jim Chalmers I've got to ask you whether you support Mark Butler's view, your colleague’s view, that coal and gas won't underpin Australia's future prosperity. Because there's a lot of people who are unhappy about those comments in the Labor Party. Where do you stand? Where do you stand on gas?
 
CHALMERS: I think gas has a role in the economy, there's a lot of investment that's gone into gas in recent years. There are jobs associated with it and manufacturers in particular rely on it, not just for energy but also for production - 
 
MILLAR: So Mark Butler got it wrong?
 
CHALMERS: - no it's possible to acknowledge that Lisa, at the same time that we acknowledge that the future will be increasingly renewable. We have the opportunity in this country to build new sources of energy which are cleaner and cheaper, we can do that without abandoning some of our traditional strengths.
 
MILLAR: You do have a problem though within the party with different views in this regard, there are schisms that we are all seeing.
 
CHALMERS: I think that there is agreement that there is a role for gas but that the future will be increasingly renewable. The task for government is to work out how we can get that cleaner and cheaper energy so the business can invest again and we get those jobs, which are the most important thing and we can reduce our emissions. People have different emphases not just in political parties but around Australia, but I think we can agree that we have a big opportunity in this country to have cleaner and cheaper energy, and gas will have a role to play throughout that, but the future is overwhelmingly renewable.
 
MILLAR: Alright, Jim Chalmers hope you get to pick up the cricket bat in the backyard in Brisbane this weekend with the kids.
 
CHALMERS: Thank you, Lisa.
 
ENDS