E&OE TRANSCRIPT
RADIO INTERVIEW
ABC RADIO NATIONAL BREAKFAST
FRIDAY, 13 MARCH 2020
SUBJECTS: Coronavirus; Economic impact of Coronavirus; Stimulus package; Labor’s response to the Global Financial Crisis.
HAMISH MACDONALD, ABC: Jim Chalmers is the Shadow Treasurer. He joins me now from Brisbane. Good morning to you.
JIM CHALMERS, SHADOW TREASURER: Good morning, Hamish.
MACDONALD: Is the Australian Government taking the seriousness of the health scenario here seriously enough?
CHALMERS: We've said we think that some of the steps that the Government has been taking are good steps but perhaps not good enough or fast enough. There is a lot of anxiety in the community. There's a real hunger for more information to be provided. I think that's reflected in your interview earlier today.
MACDONALD: But specifically, should major public events be held in Australia in the midst of this?
CHALMERS: We need to take the advice of the medical experts and the medical practitioners. That's been our approach all along. That's what's guided some of the travel bans and the issues around the Biosecurity Act, for example. It's right and proper that we continue to ask these difficult questions of the experts and we act accordingly based on the advice that we are provided.
MACDONALD: But I mean, Bill Bowtell is an expert. He guided part of Australia's response to the AIDS crisis in the 1980s. He's saying that we are not taking this seriously enough and that it would be irresponsible to hold major events like the Melbourne Grand Prix. He says that we shouldn't be going to the football on the weekend or attending mass gatherings. I mean, if we're saying we're listening to the experts, why is the advice of someone like him being ignored?
CHALMERS: I think we should follow his advice when it comes to providing more information. We should obviously consider his advice on things like being part of big crowds. The advice so far has been that if you're crook, stay away from the football. That advice will obviously evolve as the situation evolves. It's one of the things that will be discussed with the Premiers at the Council of Australian Governments’ meeting today. Our approach all along has been to listen to all the experts, but principally the Chief Medical Officer and his colleagues in the states. They've been providing advice. We've been providing bipartisan support for decisions taken on the basis of that advice.
MACDONALD: Would you be going to a major public event this weekend? I mean, are you planning to go to any sporting events? What are you doing?
CHALMERS: My Broncos are away tonight. They're in Townsville at the new stadium up there. It's not an option for me to go to the Broncos this weekend, but I would still consider going unless the advice from the Chief Medical Officer changes. I feel well, I'm not sick. One of the bits of advice is if you're sick, stay away from crowds but people will make their own decisions. If the advice changes from the Chief Medical Officer in this pretty rapidly evolving situation then people's behaviour should change then too.
MACDONALD: The issue of modelling and forecasting was raised by Bill Bowtell. It exists. The Federal Government has projections. New South Wales has indicated what it expects, up to 1.5 million people in that state alone could contract the Coronavirus. Is it, in your view, important that the Federal Government be upfront and honest with the Australian public about what the projections show?
CHALMERS: It’s always better to be as transparent as possible. That needs to be consistent with making sure that people treat that information calmly and they respond in the right ways. But typically more information is better than less information -
MACDONALD: So does it concern you that that is not being released at a national level?
CHALMERS: I'm not aware of the information that they're not releasing. Our team in the Federal Opposition gets briefings all the time, principally via Chris Bowen and Anthony Albanese, the rest of us from time to time. They'll make decisions about the information that is best released. But I think as a general rule, the more information and transparency, the better.
MACDONALD: So have you been shown modelling about projections over the coming months for the spread of Coronavirus within Australia?
CHALMERS: Not the way that you describe it, but we have avenues and opportunities to ask the Chief Medical Officer about the impacts on our communities. As you'd expect and imagine you can't go down the street in our local electorates without people asking for advice or asking about our expectations for the spread of the disease. A lot of people are going to get this virus. That's going to put enormous pressure on our health system and our economy. The more information that can be provided to people to make good decisions in that context, the better.
MACDONALD: Okay. The stimulus package is in many respects in line with what Labor did in 2008 during the Global Financial Crisis. It includes investment incentives, wage subsidies to business, $750 cash payments to lower income households, particularly to pensioners. Is there anything about this that you don't support?
CHALMERS: No Hamish we’re being supportive of the package that was announced yesterday. We're being responsible and constructive. Our priority is getting this support out the door as soon as possible so that it can be circulating in the economy. You're right that there are some striking similarities to what Labor did successfully during the Global Financial Crisis. There has been a need for some time to get that cash support out the door, but also to support employers and support apprentices. There are aspects of this package that we would do differently. For example, we don't think that they've done enough to encourage casual workers who don't have access to sick leave to stay home if they're crook. We would probably do something more substantial there. Immediately after the package was announced, Anthony Albanese and I stood up and said that we will be supportive, constructive and responsible because every Australian has a stake in the Government getting this right. We don't want to see large scale job losses or business failures. We want to support the economy and communities and that's why we need this to work.
MACDONALD: Just on the incentives for casuals to stay at home or self-isolate if there's any question about their wellness. We spoke to Cassandra Goldie earlier this morning from ACOSS. She indicated that there are actually imminent changes to the Sickness Allowance from Centrelink underway anyway. She says it's actually unclear how people could apply for that. She said that the exemption process is due to change shortly and they want the Government to delay any changes to the Sickness Allowance. Do you have a view on that? Are you calling on the Government to delay it?
CHALMERS: That's something that I've been discussing with my colleague Linda Burney who has coverage of these issues. Some other colleagues have expressed an interest here. What we want to do is make sure that any changes to the Sickness Allowance don't act as a further deterrent from people staying home if they're unwell. Our concern is that people won't be incentivised to sign up for social security and get into the system. We're worried that getting $40 a day, which is what the payment is, may be much less than people are earning so that's another disincentive. We need to look at the main objective here. The main objective here is to keep people home if they're unwell. If they do the right thing by their co-workers, we want to do the right thing by them. We don't want them to have to choose between doing the right thing by their colleagues versus being able to feed themselves and live. We think what's being proposed here is not perfect. We support the broader package but there might better be ways to do this aspect of it.
MACDONALD: The point is being made repeatedly now that this crisis is very different to the Global Financial Crisis. Whilst there are some similarities being drawn between the stimulus package then and now, the actual broader economic scenario is quite different. We're not facing a liquidity crisis globally like we did in that moment. Do you therefore think that whatever the way out will be is actually ultimately quite different?
CHALMERS: There are obviously key differences. The one we were just talking about is one of them. During the GFC there wasn't an issue about making sure casual workers stayed home if they were sick. That's one of the most important differences. The similarities are that this is a big economic challenge and it warrants a substantial response from the Government. Australians should be very proud of what they achieved together during the GFC under Labor to see off recession and to save hundreds of thousands of jobs. It remains to be seen whether what the Government announced yesterday will be similarly successful. We hope it is and that's why we will support it and try to expedite it through the Parliament.
MACDONALD: Jim Chalmers, thank you very much.
CHALMERS: Thank you, Hamish.
ENDS
