Interview with Michael Rowland, News Breakfast, ABC

MICHAEL ROWLAND:

Jim Chalmers joins us now from Brisbane. Treasurer, good morning to you.

JIM CHALMERS:

Good morning Michael.

ROWLAND:

I want to get back to the population report in a moment but just to go to one of our other top stories first: the arrest of one of those four wives of an ISIS fighter, repatriated to Australia last year, after it was discovered she travelled to a declared area in Syria in 2014 knowing her husband was an ISIS fighter. I guess the question on the lips of most Australians this morning, Treasurer, is why weren't her movements fully investigated before she was allowed back to Australia?

CHALMERS:

Michael, this is obviously part of an ongoing effort from our counterterrorism authorities. You're right that it does apply to conduct which occurred in 2014. Our understanding is that there has been no threat to the community since she returned and there's obviously a process to go through now, which involves the AFP and others, and so I don't have much to add beyond that.

ROWLAND:

Will all of the other repatriated wives and kids brought to Australia be investigated again as a result of this?

CHALMERS:

Our assurance for the Australian people and for viewers of your show, Michael, is that we will always do what is in the interests of community safety and making these decisions for the right reasons and well-founded decisions. And so people can expect us to continue to monitor and take all of the necessary steps. But again, the issue that we're talking about today is about conduct from 2014. My understanding is that there is no threat to the community since the return and there's an ongoing process involving the AFP and our counterterrorism authorities, and they should be allowed to get on and do their work.

ROWLAND:

Okay, let's go to the population report. The biggest challenge identified by the authors is the rapidly ageing Australian population. Looking forward to a decade hence, fewer and fewer working age Australians supporting a greater amount of retirees. What is the Government going to do to address that huge challenge?

CHALMERS:

It is a huge challenge, Michael. The way that our population changes and evolves and grows over time is really crucial to our society, but also to our economy as well. COVID has had an extraordinary impact on our expectations for population growth, whether it's fertility, whether it's migration, whether it's the slowest population growth a couple of years ago in the depths of COVID that we've had for more than a century - all of these things are really crucial determinants when it comes to thinking about and planning for our future. And so we need to make sure as a government and as a society that we've got the services and the infrastructure to keep up with population growth. But I think as you alluded to in your question, one of the most important things that we can do and that we are doing is to build the kind of workforce that can support a population which is getting bigger but also getting a bit older as well. And some of those trends have been exacerbated by COVID. So most of our efforts in this space - in addition to releasing this really fascinating set of data today from the Centre for Population, and the work that my colleague Clare O'Neil and others are doing with our migration review - is to make sure we get those workforce settings right. That's why childcare and early childhood education is so important. It's why skills and training is crucial, energy, technology - all of these things which will determine the workforce of the future and its capacity to support an ageing population.

ROWLAND:

If those skill shortages aren't addressed, despite all those efforts in the years ahead and the fertility rate continues to decline, is further raising the migration rate going to be the only answer?

CHALMERS:

Certainly not the only answer, Michael. Migration has been and will continue to be a really crucial part of the Australian story and the story of Australian economic success as well. But it's not a substitute on its own for the other things that we are doing - whether it's training Australians for job opportunities, whether it's making it easier and cheaper for parents, particularly new mums to work more if they want to and to earn more, whether it's all of these other steps we're taking in housing and infrastructure and the NBN, and energy policy - all of these parts of our economic plan are absolutely crucial to building the kind of workforce that can support a population, which is getting a bit older with all of the pressures that that puts on the budget.

ROWLAND:

Okay, going back to the other end of the spectrum: younger Australians. We had Cassandra Goldie, the head of ACOSS, on the show earlier this week talking about what was the routine indexation increase of the Youth Allowance, but she points out that even with that indexation increase, the Youth Allowance amounts to only $40 a day for single people living away from home. Are you comfortable with Youth Allowance being at $40 a day?

CHALMERS:

I think Cass's views on this are well known and we listen respectfully when she puts them forward. There has been a big increase as a consequence of the indexation made necessary by this higher inflation and so that indexation is flowing through in welcome ways to people who are on payments. There will always be an appetite to do more and to do better when it comes to these payments, and we will always do what we responsibly can to support people, particularly people on low and fixed incomes. We're engaging with the sector. We're engaging with experts and others in the lead up to the Budget in a committee that Amanda Rishworth and I are leading with Jenny Macklin and others to make sure that our payment system is adequate, but we've also got to make sure it's affordable and responsible. There are a series of competing pressures in the Budget, and we've got to be conscious of those as well.

ROWLAND:

And one of the solutions put forward by ACOSS and other groups, as you will be aware, is that they want the stage three tax cuts stopped. And I know you keep saying your position on the tax cuts hasn't changed. They are legislated at this stage, they are going to be brought in, but wouldn't any change or winding back of the stage three tax cuts, Treasurer, require a fresh mandate for the Government if you're re-elected by Australian voters?

CHALMERS:

It's not something I'm contemplating because, as you rightly identify in your question, our position on those tax cuts hasn't changed. And it's not the only factor, frankly, in the Budget, which people are talking about right now in welcome ways as we get towards the Budget that I'll hand down in May. There's a lot of pressure on the Budget when it comes to aged care, health care, defence spending, the NDIS, the cost of servicing the trillion dollars of debt that we inherited from our predecessors. There are a lot of pressures on the Budget, and that's why our job, our responsibility, which we embrace is to try and weigh up all of these considerations and get to the right outcomes. We did a good job in October, made a good start making the budget more sustainable, while we provided some responsible cost of living relief, and you'll see more of that in May.

ROWLAND:

One of our other main stories this morning is the mess that's happening in real time on the floor of the US House of Representatives as the search for the Speaker continues. Speaking of the US, the new Australian Ambassador to the United States, the former prime minister, Kevin Rudd, this week in an interview accused America of, in his words, throwing some of its allies under the bus when it comes to trade issues. In your view was that wise language to be used by somebody about to be the ambassador to the US?

CHALMERS:

I think Kevin Rudd's views are listened to not just in the US and in Australia, but around the world. He's an authority on foreign policy and a really fine appointment when it comes to being Australia's permanent representative in Washington DC. I think the point that he was making and a point that I embrace is that a big part of the story with all of this geopolitical uncertainty, particularly in our region, is that the economics of this are important as well. The trade and economic engagement is a really important part of maintaining a region which is peaceful and prosperous. This is a big part of the Government's objectives when it comes to our foreign policy. That's why I work so closely with Penny Wong and Richard Marles and the Prime Minister and others because the gap between what we want to achieve in the economy and what we want to achieve in foreign policy, particularly in our region, which is becoming more complex, those issues are all intertwined and I think that's the point that Kevin was making.

ROWLAND:

Okay, before we go, parts of WA, the Kimberley region, are experiencing what's been described this morning as the worst flooding the area has seen. What help is the Federal Government offering or planning to offer residents there affected by these awful floods?

CHALMERS:

We will be there for the affected communities and the affected people in those areas. Unfortunately, this is becoming a more and more frequent occurrence. Natural disasters like this and particularly in recent times, flooding - South Australia, Western Australia, not too long ago here in this part of southeast Queensland. So at times like these people are there for each other and the Federal Government will be there for them as well. We will be considering with Murray Watt, my colleague and others, the various ways that we support flood affected communities but we will be there for them and they will be there for each other no doubt.

ROWLAND:

Treasurer, appreciate your time this morning. Thank you.